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Report from an adrenaline junkie  XML
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Shantara

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Joined: 12/19/2004 18:35:28
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So, Szlat, here's my experience as a high-level adren junkie-

I, too make a mad dash for weapons at the beginning of the game. I'm not really the hiding, type, tho, so I often get up in the monsters' faces before I have enough adren to do much (ergo why Denial is your friend ).

Realistically, get an energy weapon or two and you're pretty much set for the map. Just point out how useful you are to the other players by making their vorpal 6 into a vorpal 10, and watch people line up to give you energy guns. Of course, recently I've had the problem of having 6 different pretties (like vamp 7s and such) that I can't give away to save my life. Ah well. Their loss.

I've been trying out this path with my new character, BabyShan, to see what it's like from that end as well. It is certainly more challenging at low levels than the Loaded Weapons path (oh how I miss my vamp!), but I personally like the challenge. Makes things more exciting.

I'm wondering what it will take for my country to rise,
First we admit our mistakes, then we open our eyes
--Ani Difranco

My skin: http://www.ut2003hq.com/pafiledb2/pafiledb.php?action=file&id=5094
Peldor



Joined: 04/13/2005 15:08:07
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edomingox wrote:
if you plan your skills well, you can get denial level 2 and this wouldn't be a problem of having weapons anymore.  

I was looking at that, but 30 pts (aka 4+ levels) to keep a weapon (or does it keep them all?) on respawn isn't a great bargain. A lot of times I'm on the run with the translocator when I die.

I think more health/damage reduction are the most likely 'solution' for me.
Szlat

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Joined: 05/18/2005 18:32:41
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So, Szlat, here's my experience as a high-level adren junkie 

Thanks for that Shantara. I have never really bothered with energy weapons before, but it looks I am going to have to.

So, time for some initial feedback from me, as I have now played about 5 maps as a level 46 Adrenaline junkie.

Yes, again the mad dash for weapons.

My next response was "Why isn't there more health on maps Being used to regen and vampire, I was used almost to my health taking care of itself. Now I have to keep a careful eye on it. I am finding I am often one of the first ones out, with even relatively low level monsters kicking my butt. I wish I had spent more points on damage reduction and health. Now it looks like I need to learn to dodge.

But the weapons you get are great! Twice I ended up with flak vampire+7s, then I can live a bit longer. Get a flak, use the MWM until it is a vampire, then use the max magic on it to get it +7. Then on with the triple damage, and believe me, it's fun! 3 shots to kill a titan, everytime. Just like the old days in the thick of it, trying to get more health back from vampire to cover your losses. Til the rock gets you.

But there is that waiting period when you spawn, while you get weapons and enough adrenaline to use the artifacts. Nicely balanced.

Great mod Druid, I love it.
edomingox

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Joined: 05/22/2005 16:57:45
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Peldor wrote:
I was looking at that, but 30 pts (aka 4+ levels) to keep a weapon (or does it keep them all?) on respawn isn't a great bargain.  


Your right in that respect for your character class. But Magic Masters are different. As a Magic Master...

I got loaded artifacts 3 and:
1. I get MWM.
2. It never breaks.
3. I get max magic modifier.

so then i create a weapon until i like it. namely, vampiric flak for example. then i max out the modifier. And then after having it for either wave 6 or 14, i die from a rock that was intended for someone else. well, now i'm back to the start on the next wave, wishing i had denial. tell you what, i'd pay twice that just to be able to keep a weapon like that. this really isn't so much a concern for those with loaded weapons because they always start off with weapons and level 5 is always positive weapons. i believe this is a must for magic masters.

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Szlat

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Joined: 05/18/2005 18:32:41
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Is it true that denial will not keep a one-drop weapon?
If so, that would be a shame from the Magic Masters point of view
TheDruidXpawX

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Szlat wrote:
Is it true that denial will not keep a one-drop weapon?
If so, that would be a shame from the Magic Masters point of view  


That's not true anymore. It will let you keep any weapon

Skin download: http://www.disastrousconsequences.com/dcforum/posts/list/1189.page

The fundamental problem is this: The first word we learn as children is NO. From that point forward society teaches women that saying no isn't polite, and society teaches men to respect those who wont take no for an answer.

The world is what you make of it, my friend. If it doesn't fit, you make alterations. -- Stella, The Morning Star
Szlat

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Joined: 05/18/2005 18:32:41
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That's not true anymore. It will let you keep any weapon  

Excellent.
Why is it you are always one step ahead of me?
Peldor



Joined: 04/13/2005 15:08:07
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edomingox wrote:

Your right in that respect for your character class. But Magic Masters are different. As a Magic Master...

I got loaded artifacts 3 

I'm the one who started the thread. See Alindyar in the stats. I'm just now to the point where I can get denial anyway (level 28, level 25 needed), and loaded artifacts 3 and energy leech 3 seem like more pressing needs. It's still a challenge to build up adrenaline for booster and the mwm, plus the mwm breaks.

Did you start from level 5 or start with a bunch of points from a higher level character?
Peldor



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I found out today that using Max Magic Modifier on a Draining weapon turns it into a +3 Energy. Very handy, and saves 100 adrenaline spent on using the MWM. I haven't had a chance to try a Misfortune or Slowfoot. Do those become Lucky & Quickfoot respectively?

I also found out that the Max Magic Modifier doesn't work on non-magical weapons. So you really do need the use MWM and then the MMM if you pick up a plain weapon.
Shantara

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Yeah, Peldor- Max will make it a positive one, if it was negative, and reverse its cursed effect. But regular weapons aren't considered magical, therefore maxing out their "magical" properties doesn't do anything.


I'm wondering what it will take for my country to rise,
First we admit our mistakes, then we open our eyes
--Ani Difranco

My skin: http://www.ut2003hq.com/pafiledb2/pafiledb.php?action=file&id=5094
KampKounslr


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Hmm, t'would be nice that for regular weapons, maxing its stat out gives it max Damage Bonus (the plain "+x" modifier with no PreText or PostText)

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Szlat

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Ok, time for an update from an adrenaline junkie.

Magic Master is great for getting good weapons, since you spawn with the MWM and it doesn't break. Once you have the type you want, just max it. Unfortunately, without regen and vampire, you can't use the weapons as effectively as a LW weapons master. If you get in the middle of the battle, you end up dead alot easier than with LW.

So, long distance with vorpal shock or mini of infinity are the sensible options (but not as much fun)

Where possible, I will hand out what weapons I can duplicate - unfortunately really good ones like vampire and infinity always seem to be one drop weapons. Is there any chance that these weapon types could occassionally be droppable?

One thing I have found. It takes a while for me to accumulate adrenaline. Once I have it, I am reluctant to use booster as it just swallows it all. It would be a lot better to have an artifact of healing, that you could switch off after you have recovered what health you want. For example, if I am down by 50 health, I'll take the risk of looking for health rather than boostering so I can use the adrenaline for something else. Then I turn the corner, and splat, I'm dead. Whereas if i could just use some of the adrenaline to recover the 50, I would have.

I notice from the player stats that not many high level players have moved over to LA. Obviously some will be coming up the ranks, but LA still hasn't got the pulling power of LW. I think part of the problem is that you are still using weapons to get the points, and in battle LW with redeemers and vampire will always do better.

If it is supposed to be a magic master class, where are the attacking charms that don't involve weapons? Where is the magic wand?
For example, how about extra artifacts for LA level 4:
- Be able to create redeemer like explosions
- Transmorph all monsters in a certain radius to crabs (and get the difference in exp/adrenaline)
- health leech - absorb up to 100 health from each of all opponents in range

Could make them all use 200 or 250 adrenaline, but would give the class some serious punch.

Still, it's fun to play this class. You are more in control, since you choose what weapons you end up with (except superweapons). But I am saving up for more damage reduction and denial.
TheDruidXpawX

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Szlat wrote:

Magic Master is great for getting good weapons, since you spawn with the MWM and it doesn't break. Once you have the type you want, just max it. Unfortunately, without regen and vampire, you can't use the weapons as effectively as a LW weapons master. If you get in the middle of the battle, you end up dead alot easier than with LW.
 

Yup! That's exactly what I'm trying to do

Szlat wrote:

So, long distance with vorpal shock or mini of infinity are the sensible options (but not as much fun)
 

Realistically, you get better points when these are up front and personal too, but you always have to be paying more attention to your health with this class. It's supposed to be trickier to play.

Szlat wrote:

Where possible, I will hand out what weapons I can duplicate - unfortunately really good ones like vampire and infinity always seem to be one drop weapons. Is there any chance that these weapon types could occassionally be droppable?
 

No.. I think the class would be way too exploitable if you could.

Szlat wrote:

One thing I have found. It takes a while for me to accumulate adrenaline. Once I have it, I am reluctant to use booster as it just swallows it all. It would be a lot better to have an artifact of healing, that you could switch off after you have recovered what health you want. For example, if I am down by 50 health, I'll take the risk of looking for health rather than boostering so I can use the adrenaline for something else. Then I turn the corner, and splat, I'm dead. Whereas if i could just use some of the adrenaline to recover the 50, I would have.
 

The verdict on this one is still out. Right after I put the class into place I though about this too. I might do this, although after playing the class for a while, I'm somewhat reluctant to do so. I want you to have to spend your adrenaline on other things, otherwise you've always got a vorpal shock 20.

Szlat wrote:

I notice from the player stats that not many high level players have moved over to LA. Obviously some will be coming up the ranks, but LA still hasn't got the pulling power of LW. I think part of the problem is that you are still using weapons to get the points, and in battle LW with redeemers and vampire will always do better.
 

On a titan wave, a vorpal shock +20 will always dominate. I score about evenly as a similarly skilled player with Loaded weapons at my same level. I've been keeping track where I can.

As it stands though, I fully expect Loaded Weapons to have more players. When I create my third class, I suspect it will have the least number of players, and it will be harder to play than this class.

Szlat wrote:

If it is supposed to be a magic master class, where are the attacking charms that don't involve weapons? Where is the magic wand?
 

I agree. I'd rather it was a bit less weapon based than it is. At some point I may add more artifacts to achieve this goal.

Szlat wrote:

- Be able to create redeemer like explosions
 

This sounds a bit obscene ...

Szlat wrote:

- Transmorph all monsters in a certain radius to crabs (and get the difference in exp/adrenaline)
 

Maybe this, without the difference in exp or adrenaline. I'm not sure how easy it would be to do though. I'll think on it... It does sound fun if all the warlords in the area suddenly became pupae.

Szlat wrote:

- health leech - absorb up to 100 health from each of all opponents in range
 

This is the same problem that I'm trying to limit unfortunately... I want you to have to spend your adrenaline on health.

Szlat wrote:

Could make them all use 200 or 250 adrenaline, but would give the class some serious punch.
 

See note above on vorpal +20 shock. I think it already does

Szlat wrote:

Still, it's fun to play this class. You are more in control, since you choose what weapons you end up with (except superweapons). But I am saving up for more damage reduction and denial.
 


I'm glad you enjoy it.

Skin download: http://www.disastrousconsequences.com/dcforum/posts/list/1189.page

The fundamental problem is this: The first word we learn as children is NO. From that point forward society teaches women that saying no isn't polite, and society teaches men to respect those who wont take no for an answer.

The world is what you make of it, my friend. If it doesn't fit, you make alterations. -- Stella, The Morning Star
Szlat

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Joined: 05/18/2005 18:32:41
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Thanks for the response. You are right as always.

But it would be nice to be able to switch off the booster....
Peldor



Joined: 04/13/2005 15:08:07
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I agree that booster would be nicer if it switched off or there was a summon health rune, nevertheless...

I find that I can hang in the top few scorers given two conditions: I start from Wave 1 & I don't die. Starting at the beginning of the map gets me a lot of easy adrenaline to get a couple of nice maxed weapons (usually). Once I die, it's usually pretty pitiful unless I happen to get lucky with my new weapon pickups or had a lot of adrenaline left.

Gordon Freeman is the only very high level player I've seen doing the Loaded Artifact thing other than Shan and Dru.
 
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