[Logo]
 
  [Search] Search   [Recent Topics] Recent Topics   [Members]  Member Listing   [Groups] Back to home page 
[Register] Register / 
[Login] Login 
Word of warning: Don't get scammed  XML
Forum Index -> Banter Go to Page: 1, 2 Next 
Author Message
320

Wicked Sick!

Joined: 10/11/2005 21:28:38
Messages: 605
Offline

Hey folks, I post this here because in a couple other forums I belong to I've seen this stuff get out of hand. I'm talking about Internet "investment" scams and "autosurf" programs. These are pyramid and/or ponzi schemes. The most notorious at the moment is called "12DailyPro" where they promise ridiculous rates of return on "investments" just for viewing web sites for five minutes a day (auto surfing).

In another forum, I just saw a ponzi collapse and literally hundreds lost their money. I, among others, tried to warn people but they had dollar signs in their eyes and shouted us down.

Anyway, if anyone wants to know more, I'm willing to explain these scams in some detail. But bottom line:

1) A fool and his money are soon parted.

2) If it's too good to be true, it probably is.

3) Any good con plays off the greed of the mark. Don't let greed get the best of you.


v0rTeX

Wicked Sick!
[Avatar]

Joined: 12/19/2004 20:59:52
Messages: 562
Offline

Here, here.

If anyone would like free money, they should invest it into something with a reasonable return interest rate.
Okinesu

Dominating
[Avatar]

Joined: 12/19/2004 20:45:34
Messages: 234
Location: San Marcos, TX
Offline

v0rTeX wrote:
Here, here.

If anyone would like free money, they should invest it into something with a reasonable return interest rate.  


^^^ sage for good advice

Disastrous Consequences
[WWW] aim icon
320

Wicked Sick!

Joined: 10/11/2005 21:28:38
Messages: 605
Offline

The really disapointing thing is that people were so caught up in the excitement of it that even once they understood that ponzis are illegal (knowingly participating in a ponzi is illegal), they just didn't care. At that point, you can't really feel sorry for them when their money dissapears.

Faith in humanity.... dwindling...

At the same time, every age and demographic is vulnerable to being scammed. Take Enron and what they did to consumers in California, for example. Even normal, intelligent people got swindled pretty hard.
320

Wicked Sick!

Joined: 10/11/2005 21:28:38
Messages: 605
Offline

This is a followup to a thread I started several months ago.

A quick recounting: I belong to the forum on shoryuken.com, a fighting-game site. About five months ago I saw a classic ponzi unfolding and literally dozens, if not hundreds, of obviously young and naive kids forking over what little money they had.

The whole thing was perpetuated by a guy named Duc Do. For about a year or so, Duc was basically the World Champion at Marvel Vs. Capcom 2. He is still a top national player. But his reputation for being a champion player made him a hero to a lot of kids on shoryuken.com. He initially promoted a scheme called "Studio Traffic". Eventually Studio Traffic failed but these young, naive kids didn't see that as a problem. They thought they just missed "the opportunity", like a stock that went up, hit its peak and was now coming back down. But Duc had lit the fire and soon, others were promoting other "investment opportunities".

The one that took center stage was a ponzi called 12DailyPro. You were supposedly paid to surf internet sites and view advertisements. You're paid a very small amount for this but you could also "invest" in it to increase the amount you were paid to surf. They gauranteed you 1% of what you had invested every day for a 12-day cycle.

12% return in 12 days?

The whole operation was "dressed up" with investment advice/strategies and the like to give it the appearance of legitimacy. As the older of you already know, it collapsed and the crooks basically dissapeared with the lion's share of the money.

EDIT: It is reported that 12DailyPro had approxiamately 300,000 accounts and 50 Million Dollars when it failed. It was so big it was reported by several news outlets.

So, all that said, while I am a big believer in "Buyer Beware" and being responsible, the fact is, these scumbags prey on the ignorance of young people with the sole intent of stealing their money.

I wrote a series of posts explaining a bit about these schemes and who runs them. I've re-packaged and re-post them here because the vast majority of people in the DC community are very cool and I would feel bad to see anyone lose a lot of money like this.


320

Wicked Sick!

Joined: 10/11/2005 21:28:38
Messages: 605
Offline

Post 1:

Re: I have inside information regarding Duc Do (ST Scam Artist)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Intersting thread. I saw the original posts for Studio Traffic and 12dp on shoryuken.com. I was surprised and dissapointed that Duc was involved as he's a player with incredible talent. Several other very high-profile tournament players started participating as well, guys that we've been reading about in gaming magazines for 10+ years. So sad.

Their greed was their own undoing. Even after I and others showed conclusively that 12dp was a classic ponzi scheme, they still made excuses and stayed in. See, every good con plays off the greed of the mark. And after the mark is swindled, they realize it was their own greed that got the best of them. It's that realization that makes most marks not talk about it afterwards or go to the police.

I gather from what's been written (on the shoryuken and talkgold forums) that most of you are relatively young and probably don't have a lot of money, and don't have a lot of EXERIENCE with money. You are easy marks. You have no idea what a real investment return is. The scumbags know you don't know that, too.

When you consider "investments" in the future, think about this: A relatively decent return in a S+P 500 index fund would be about 10 - 15% annually. That means if you started with 1,000, you would probably have between 1100 - 1150 after one full year. Doesn't sound like a lot, does it? And that amount is not gauranteed. If the market goes down, you can and will lose money.

But think about that: 10 - 15% ANNUALLY and compare that to what these auto-surf places were offering. They were offering 12% in 12 DAYS. That would be approxiamately 3000% of the return on a decent S+P 500 index fund, without even factoring compounding. In other words, when people promise you returns like this, it is ALWAYS a scam.

Another thing you need to understand is what a Sociopath (sometimes called a Pyschopath) is. A sociopath is a person with no conscience. They understand the difference between right and wrong but simply don't care one little bit about doing the right thing. They are excellent conmen, manipulators and liars. They can lie with a totally straight face because they don't feel the least bit bad that they're lying. Contrary to several popular beliefs, sociopaths are not necessarily violent (like Ted Bundy or Jeffrey Dahmer). They are typically good-looking, charismatic and appear to be intelligent.

It is estimated by various sources that 3% of males and 1% of females in north america are sociopathic. (Source: "Without Conscience", Robert Hare, Phd.)

See, this is another way you got conned. When you try to make sense of why ST did this or Storm Pay did that, you are considering the situation from the standpoint of a conscience-driven person. You are thinking "*I* wouldn't screw someone else over, never mind screw over hundreds of thousands of people. I just can't believe someone would do that. How could they live with themselves afterwards?" That's your line of thought. That's why you keep believing and keep giving them the benefit of the doubt. That's why you think at some point you might get your money back.

Here's the sociopath's line of thought: "I just screwed over 300,000 people to the tune of 50 million! LOL. What a bunch of idiots! And they still think they're gonna get paid! What a bunch of greedy fools!"

Not only does the sociopath not feel bad, s/he is LAUGHING at you. Screwing you over makes him/her feel good.

Another thing about sociopaths is they do not really consider the consequences of their actions. They don't think "I better not do this, I might go to jail." Here's what they think: "People are so stupid, I'll never be caught."

Young people, in particular, need to know that you are constantly targeted for exploitation because of your inexperience, high debt and low wages. You want the nice car to impress the girls but how do you get the money when your job doesn't pay much? So you look for a "loophole", a way to "beat the system" and these scumbags feed you what you want to hear. Believe me, the vast majority of young people go through this phase and think these thoughts.
320

Wicked Sick!

Joined: 10/11/2005 21:28:38
Messages: 605
Offline

Originally Posted by TheInternetMan
jcasetnl

Your absolutley correct with all your points on everything.

I was someone who is young and lost a fair amount just as you described. Personally I am happy I have learned and secondly I am happy I have learned at a young age too.

Since St I never invested in autosurf again and I dont plan ever to do any of these investments they really dont work its far too unrealistic no one can pay the money they were saying they could pay to members.

I never joined 12dp because they never had any other businesses to back it up so I thought no way they can pay. But the reason I went for ST was because they were suppose to not operate like a ponzi and had other business to back it up but obviously it was all a lie.

I think its a rubbish indusrty to be involved with. I even believe people who invest in autosurf are very greedy too and selfish because they dont care about the people who will suffer at the end and its a very bad attitude to have. I will stay away from autosurf for 3 reasons not for me to loose, and because I would feel guilty for the people who will eventually loose and not to encourage the scammers who run it.



InternetMan,

Good for you.

Maybe Studio Traffic had a better 'front' than 12DP, but what lies beneath is the same thing. See, this is what I mean when I say most young people are gullible and ignorant. I'm not trying to be a jerk, I'm just warning people that even though they think they're being careful, they still weren't nearly careful enough. Most importantly, you don't have the education and experience to know what being careful truly entails.

The comment "ST had other sources of revenue" for example. Next time you're in this situation, ask these questions:

Who? How many? What was the amount of the revenue? What are STs operating costs? Could that revenue account for profit that is roughly 3000% of a good index fund return?

A lot of young people think this is "secret" info that companies never tell others. Totally wrong.

In the world of public investing (stocks, mutual funds, etc), this information must be disclosed (by law) so that you, as the potential investor, can have some basic facts before you risk your cash.

Private companies do not, necessarily have to disclose this by law. But if I, personally, was investing with a private party I would demand they disclose all this and a heck of a lot more.

So there's clue no. 2. An investment scheme marketed to the general public that does not disclose core financials is a scam!

But for young people? All they need is to be told "Studio Trade is not a ponzi because we have other sources of revenue" and young people go, "Oh cool. Okay, here's all my money."

I am glad you didn't get screwed by 12dp, however. And what I hope is that you don't get involved with ANY of this stuff, ponzi, mlm, conga line, etc. They all have one and only one goal and trying to "beat" them at their own game is difficult and will drain you further.

Your best bet in the short term to not get screwed is simply look at the bottom line and compare that to a 15% annual return. If any company is promising returns of 500+% for practically zero work (surfing the internet??!!! Get real, a five year old could do it.), it's a scam. It doesn't matter that they have a handful of advertisors or even a THOUSAND advertisors. Google is one of the most powerful ad platforms on the net and they cannot, never in a billion years, deliver 3000% of the S+P return to google shareholders annually.

If you want to put your money to work for you, as a young person, the first thing you need to do is SAVE it and live within your means. Make every effort you can to live debt-free. For 95% of young people, a credit card is a really bad idea. Most of you don't need one until the age of 25 or 30.

Then you need to educate yourself. Understand retirement accounts, Mutual Funds, GDP and other market indicators, tax-sheltered investments and on and on. If you have a chunk of money, don't invest it in anything with more than low or zero risk until you feel supremely confident you know what you're doing. Stick that money in a 3 or 6 month CD and live with the low, gauranteed and federally insured return while you hit the books.

If you don't take the time to educate yourself, you might as open the Wall Street Journal and throw a dart at it. You're throwing your hard-earned money away.
320

Wicked Sick!

Joined: 10/11/2005 21:28:38
Messages: 605
Offline

Post 3:

One of the big tricks in the sociopath toolbox is redirecting the blame away from themselves. I point it out because in the wake of the 12dp disaster, a lot of people have been convinced to blame stormpay, some even clamoring for legal action, etc. "Charis (person running 12DailyPro) really cares about us, it's that evil Stormpay!" LOL, okay, whatever you say.

(Note: Stormpay was the payment processor for 12dailypro. They are a small-time operation that offers similar services to Paypal and was one of the ways "investors" would recieve their payments from 12Dailypro. Stormpay was forced to freeze assets and payouts when government officials began investigating. As a result, the Scammers behind many ponzi schemes blamed Stormpay as a way to deflect blame from themselves. Some speculate Stormpay has been cooperating with the ponzi schemes all along.)

I don't know what the true situation is with stormpay, for what it's worth. They could be shadow partners with 12dp or a legit operation. It doesn't change the fact that 12dp was out to con you. The reason some cling to blaming stormpay is this very common thing in psychology: Denial.

The other redirection they employ is blaming YOU! "You risked more than you could afford to lose." Sounds familiar, right? And it seems to make some sense, right?

No! Because you didn't RISK anything. The word "risk" implies that 12dp was a legitimate investment with legitimate investment risks and legitimate value creation goals. 12dp was a scam designed from the ground up to steal money. That is not "risk", that's good old theft.

What if I said, "I'm starting a restuarant and I want you to invest in it for a cut of the profits." Then I take your money and go to Vegas and blow it on booze and the race track. Is that "risk" or a "risky" investment? No, my intention was NEVER to open a restaurant, just CONvince you that I was so I could get your money and skip town. There was no investment "risk" because there was no investment! This is the case in ALL PONZIS.

So I come back and you say, "Where's my money?" And I reply, "You shouldn't have risked more than you could afford to lose!" This is the ridiculous argument the scammers are making.

You see what they did? By telling you "Don't risk what you can't afford to lose" they made you blame yourself for your loss.

They say: "You're being paid to autosurf!"

No, you're not. That's purely a facade to CONvince you the operation is legitimate so you'll hand over your money. And honestly, it's such a terrifically lame one, I am surprised so many fall for it. Guess where your money is? In an investment? LOL. No. It's in Vegas being spent on booze and the racetrack.


If you want to get ahead of the curve:

1) Find something you love to do and which people are willing to pay for and learn to do it better than other people.

2) SAVE YOUR MONEY. Most investment returns are pathetic with the amounts of money young people typically have. Remember the S+P return of 10 - 15% I mentioned? In a good year you make 15%. But if you only had $100 to invest that's only $15! Your time would have been much better spent working a few extra hours.

But what if you had $100,000? Then 15% is $15,000. Now, it is much more worth your time to invest. So the best investment strategy for young people is to SAVE your money and put it in very low risk and/or federally insured investments (bank account, CD, treasury bond, etc.). When you have the money to invest and turn a worthwhile profit, that's when you start considering it seriously.

3) Live within your means and minimize debt. If you can't make rent, car payment, food, movies, toys, etc. and still save 10% every month, you are living beyond your means. One unexpected emergency situation is all it would take to potentially bankrupt you. You need to either get a second job or cut back.

No, cable tv is not a necessity. Spending $10 for a ticket at the movie theater is not a necessity. Buying a coffee at starbucks every morning is not a necessity. Eating out at restaurants is not a necessity.

When I was in my late-teens I bought a couple books that promised to teach me the secrets to "wealth and happiness" and all that crap. They were complete junk, obviously. At least in my case I probably wasted $30. Seeing people blow hundreds or thousands these days and waste so much time is sad indeed. In summary, I hope what I've written convinces some of you to re-think all of these MMF schemes. NOT ONE IS LEGIT. NOT ONE GENERATES REAL VALUE.
Grizzled_Imposter

Wicked Sick!
[Avatar]
Joined: 02/20/2006 15:59:35
Messages: 713
Offline

All too true.

If only someone had told me these things 15 or 20 years ago.

Oh, wait. they did. I didn't listen.....

Core 2 DUO @ 4.1Ghz Grizzled_AM AM 43
Nvidia 9800 1g Grizzled_EMT. MM 85
4gb mem Grizzled_LW WM 87
Grizzled_EN EN 64
A drop of knowledge is more powerful than a sea of force~ unknown
[Email]
Shadow-X

Rampage

Joined: 01/22/2006 13:46:46
Messages: 114
Offline

You mean i won't be getting that hummer i wanted through these people
Spacey

Wicked Sick!
[Avatar]

Joined: 01/07/2005 21:28:14
Messages: 589
Location: Da'Burgh (Pittsburgh) PA
Offline

First, a couple of items in reply to thread so far, then a few additional insights.

V0rTeX wrote:

If anyone would like free money, they should invest it into something with a reasonable return interest rate. 


Best free money I know of is to contribute to your 401k or equivilent retirement fund to the point where any employer match is maximized. So if your company matches your 401k contribution, and they do the typical is 1/2 of what you contribute, up to a total of 3% of your pay, make sure you contribute at least 6%.

Regarding the 12% return in 12 days...here is something that will really stress out how big of a scam it really was. If I invested just $1, and kept re-investing for just short of a year (360 days, or 30 12-day periods), I would get back $29.96. But if I and everyone I know invested $1000, it would not take long before they owed each and everyone around $29K more than they invested. If there were around a mear 350,000 who invested, you are talking $10 BILLION dollars being paid out, which is more than IBM had in profits in 2005. Indeed, there are only 9 companies with more profit than this, and the largest, Exxon, had profits of only just over 3 times this, and there is no way that a company will pay out that large of a dividend. Indeed, Exxon, with 6B shares outstanding and a dividend of $1.28/share, only paid out about $7.68B So when you check it out, this scam was promising a larger payout in a year than any of the Fortune-10 companies!

Now, since we are also talking about how to really invest your money, here is what I can tell you about good investments, as based on what my Dad has done. First, he took his GI discharge grant from way back when in the 50's, which amounted to perhaps $5000, and rather than buy a new car, he bought stock in a company which was to be known as Martin Marietta, and is now known as Lockheed Martin. I won't give you exact figures on how much it is worth now, but I wills say that he sold some about 15 years ago, and he still has daily swings which are generally between 2 and 3 times what he invested way back when. Indeed, I think there was one day here recently where just on LMT, his portfolio changed by more than we paid for our new maxed out Caravan last fall! The key here is that if you invest in stocks, pick them carefully, and invest for the long haul. And don't try day trading. You cannot react quickly enough to the peaks and valleys which the which the major holders, like the mutual funds (or potentially even my Dad, if he sold it off in one chunk), introduce into mix. Oh, and with the dividends paid to him on this and one other stock of which he has a large holding, along with his manditory CD/IRA distributions, he has essentially been able to stay at the same cash levels, even having to pay for his assisted living facility, medical costs, etc. And he still re-invests much of his CDs and IRAs, outside of the manditory distributions.

I will also say something else about stocks and funds, gained from having seen what happened while working with Lucent. We had a employee stock purchase plan (shares at a potentially reduced price), and in our 401k, we had several options which were based off of Lucent stock in some form. I saw too many people get hammered as Lucent's stock plumeted starting in 2000, and friends who were all set to retire and live well are now working for different companies and not living as well as they were before they were either forced to retire or were laid off. My recomendation is to remember not to put all your eggs in one basket, and to diversify. Indeed, I am less in favor of holding stock in most cases, and instead going with a diversified mutual fund with a proven history and more folks involved in managing it than I can possibly do.

Now, things like CDs were also mentioned. Those are good for when you are looking at periods of 3-months up to say 3 or 5 years, and you generally get about 4% per year, or 21% in 5 years. And the rate is guarenteed, as far as I have heard. And for longer term investments, savings bonds are another option. The rules periodically change, and differ for the different series. But as an example, the Series EE bonds are purchased for 1/2 face value, and will reach that face value in around 17-20 years, and will continue to earn interest for some time past that. So you are guarenteed a given interest rate for a certain period. The best thing to do if considering this option is to go to http://www.savingsbonds.com and do some research.

Now, as 320 said, if you cannot say that you are saving a decent percentage of your income (10% every month is a good round figure for a monthly goal, but even 2% is still better than none...but the key is, the more, the better), look at things you can reduce out of what you are spending each month. I will not say that if you don't save 10%, you are living beyond your means, or that eating out or anything else is not a necessity. Indeed, the occasional "fun" which helps reduce your stress levels and keeps you healthy and sane may save you some more costly expenses in the long run. But keep the goal in mind, make out a budget, and practice moderation in those areas where you can control the expenses.

BTW...in my case, my wife is disabled with Fibro and Lupus, she really cannot cook and I do not feel like it after working all day. And I have not really had a pay raise since around 2000 due to working first for Lucent, being laid off for a year, and then working for a pre-IPO startup which has not given a raise since it was started outside of those given with promotions. All the while, the cost of our food, gas, electric, and other expenses has gone up. And even with all of that, I still save a minimum of 6% each month, on a pre-tax basis, into my 401K. What I had managed to save up over 7 years allowed us to keep the house, keep the van, keep paying all the other bills which could not be deferred, etc. for 6 months after unemployment ran out, and to supplement things for several months before that. Yes, I paid a 10% penalty for pulling money out on top of the taxes I owed, but we survived. And I am still trying to come up with ways to not only increase my 401k withholding to the max, but to also max out our IRA contributions, and save back a nice amount of cash on top of that.

I will also say this...instead of renting, if you are going to live someplace for more than a few years, consider buying a place, especially if your income is relatively stable. Yes, you do have maintenance costs, but it is much better to be paying $650 PITI (principle, intrest, tax and insurance) each month and building up equity than to be paying $650 each month to rent a place where the landlord does not fix things and you do not build up any equity. After all, he would likely also have to cover PITI on the property you rent from him, so why shouldn't you get the equity instead of them. Yes, sometimes your property taxes and insurance do go up, but I will say that they have gone up less for us than our rent did. And besides, as the market values go up, you also get the benifit of that instead of the landlord.

Also, if you do buy a home, consider that if you always stay current and make one extra payment a year on your mortgage and direct it towards your principle, you can cut a significant amount off of the total interest you pay, as well cutting time off of how long you will have to pay. My Mother did this in an extreme case, where she was earning enough to make double principle payments many months. So rather than getting say 5% in a bank account or some other form of investment and paying the 7.5% on the loan for the next several years, she paid down the house and turned a 30-year loan into a 10-year loan. (Note: the interest rates are just examples, I do not know what they really were. But believe it or not, I could actually find out...the payment books are still in the fireproof safe where Mom put them years ago).

So do some research, do a bit more homework to do some planning, and start saving in legitimate channels.


*BEL*_e (spacey), BEL Clan General -- You Frag em, I'll Slag em!
LA -- *BEL*_e (level 283 - Extreme AM), LW -- *BEL*_o (level 26) MM - ?? ( *BEL*_Rolaids ?? *BEL*DrWho??, Engineer... *BEL*BS_E_E [BSEE '89, Ohio U] (level 22)

[Email] [WWW] [Yahoo!] aim icon [MSN] [ICQ]
320

Wicked Sick!

Joined: 10/11/2005 21:28:38
Messages: 605
Offline

Mostly I agree, Spacey, except on buying property. Right now the market is too over-valued in many places. In the bay area, seriously, I can rent for literally HALF of PITI. Houses are so disconnected from fundamentals it's downright scary. It could potentially lead to a bank crash in the next few years.

You probably missed the creative financing revolution (it started around 2002 when interest rates bottomed out), but that's already starting to kill people. I read one statistic that foreclosures are already up 38% from the same month last year. About 75% of the houses purchased in the bay area in 2005 were bought with either ARMs or interest-only loans. Considering inflation, higher interest rates and flattening home prices, that means the purchasers are actually in negative equity.

If any of you bought a house with an interest-only loan or an ARM in the last couple years, best check that reset cycle and start crunching some numbers... you might be handing the keys back to the bank...

InsaneManiac

Rampage
[Avatar]

Joined: 04/27/2006 07:23:22
Messages: 159
Location: San Diego, California
Offline

Nice work with the Pyramid type scam you have researched 320. A lot of this info is very informative, but for me it is also very confusing. One thing I can add to this is when online, make sure that whatever your buying is backed up by a reputable seller or company. If your nervous about that site, company, dealer etc. You should see if there is any information about them and see if their trustworthy. One thing I do have to add is watch out for a company PC Infinity Systems Plus. There have been a lot of complaints and reports filed with the Better Business Bearau about these guys. PC Infinity also goes under the guise of two other sites, I cant remember which two it was though. But if your The site I suggest if you want to do research is
Later...

Ressellerratings.com

"Kindness from the Heart is Compassion from the Soul." -Unknown-



A proud member of the VGVN.
[Email] [Yahoo!] aim icon [MSN]
320

Wicked Sick!

Joined: 10/11/2005 21:28:38
Messages: 605
Offline

InsaneManiac wrote:
Nice work with the Pyramid type scam you have researched 320. A lot of this info is very informative, but for me it is also very confusing. One thing I can add to this is when online, make sure that whatever your buying is backed up by a reputable seller or company. If your nervous about that site, company, dealer etc. You should see if there is any information about them and see if their trustworthy. One thing I do have to add is watch out for a company PC Infinity Systems Plus. There have been a lot of complaints and reports filed with the Better Business Bearau about these guys. PC Infinity also goes under the guise of two other sites, I cant remember which two it was though. But if your The site I suggest if you want to do research is
Later...

Ressellerratings.com 


Insane: Yeah, I know it can all be kind of confusing. So let me provide some succinct tips:

Note that I am NOT a financial advisor and the following constitutes my personal opinion, not investment advice. If you are considering any investment, consult the services of a professional. If your company offers a 401k plan, usually you can speak with one of the plans representatives who can supply you with information and learning tools to understand what options are available to you. Ultimately, your investment decisions are up to you and you bear the responsibility.

1) Any time you see HYIP (High Yield Investment Program) it is a scam.

2) Any time any investment gaurantees high returns, particularly with a gaurantee or assurances of low or no risk, it is a scam. No legitimate investment containing risk ever makes gaurantees of performance or guarantees of low or no risk. It is against the law to do so.

3) The only gauranteed return investments are those that are Federal-Insured. Your bank's savings account is an example. If the bank totally fails, the Federal Government insures your money up to $100,000. Most CDs (Certificate of Deposit) are federal-insured.

You will notice that ALL of these gauranteed investments I just mentioned are low-paying because they contain no risk. There is no such thing as a low-risk, high-yield investment. None.

4) Any time an investment claims to pay substantially more than what your bank advertises as it's savings account interest rate or the rates on its federal-insured investments, you are entering into an investment that, at a minimum, contains risk. Worst case, it's a scam. Call your bank and ask them what their current savings account interest rate is.

5) Any investment that attempts to pursuade you with phrases like "Time is of the essence, you must act now!" or "Don't miss this opportunity!" are likely scams.

6) Any time you encounter a "business opportunity" that promotes the idea of a "down-line" it is likely a pyramid-scheme, more commonly called "Multi-level marketing". Some of these organizations have managed to keep one foot inside the legal line and thus, you may be enticed. I have met many, many people who have invested in these things and all of them have lost a lot of money doing so.





InsaneManiac

Rampage
[Avatar]

Joined: 04/27/2006 07:23:22
Messages: 159
Location: San Diego, California
Offline

Thanks for the info 320. You really did your homework when it comes to a this kind of thing. Correct me if I'm wrong, it comes down to checking the facts and using common sense. If it's too good to be true then it probably isnt. Something I have learned is you cant get something for nothing. No matter what you have to put in an equal amount of work to gain something back.

"Kindness from the Heart is Compassion from the Soul." -Unknown-



A proud member of the VGVN.
[Email] [Yahoo!] aim icon [MSN]
 
Forum Index -> Banter Go to Page: 1, 2 Next 
Go to: