Weapon Speed vs. Attack Bonus?

I'm curious 'bout Weapon Speed, especially in comparison to Attack Bonus. It's mentioned that each point in attack boosts base damage +0.5%, but what does one point in Weapon Speed do? +0.5% firing rate?

Using this FAQ as a (hopefully accurate) baseline for the Shock Rifle:

Damage vs. People: 45
Rate of Fire: 20/10s

.. which boils down to 2shots/s for a potential 90dam/s.

Ergo, each point in Attack Bonus adds +0.5% (4.5dam/s) for a total of 94.5dam/s.

A rate of fire increase will utilize the following formula: 90dam/(1 - [Weapon Speed Modifier] * [Weapon Speed Stat])s

If [Weapon Speed Modifier] is, in fact, +0.5%, then one point reduces the firing rate from 1s to 0.95s for ~94.74dam/s.

So to reiterate my question: what's the rate-of-fire increase per point spent in Weapon Speed? +0.5%?

Thanks!

Unfortunately, it's not quite as simple as that, and has been covered before (but I couldn't seem to find it on the forums?). I haven't got the code in front of me, but from memory:

First a correction. If each point in Attack Bonus (or Damage Bonus) adds +0.5%, then 1 point added will add 90*0.005 = 0.45 damage, not 4.5 damage.

For weapon speed, the formula is
new fire rate = old fire rate / (1 +(0.01 * Weaponspeed))

Assuming the shock fires 2 times per sec, this would make it fire every 0.5 secs.
So, a weapon speed of 10, would give a new fire rate of 0.5/(1 +0.1) = 0.45..., and would result in 99 damage per sec.
A weapon speed of 50 (max) would give a fire rate of 0.333, giving 135 damage per sec.

So, in simple terms, 10 points on weapon speed gives 99 damage per sec, while adding 10 points on attack bonus gives you 94.5 damage per sec. So weapon speed looks better.

Remember that the faster the fire rate, the faster you run out of ammo. If you are a medic with an infinite weapon, then knock up your weapon speed.

However, the damage bonus doesn't directly increase the damage you do. It is offset against the monster damage reduction. The basic formula is
Damage = Damage * (1 + (InstigatedData.Attack - InjuredData.Defense)/200))
Where InstigatedData.Attack is your damage bonus and InjuredData.Defense is the monsters damage reduction.
If the monster's DR gets 200 above your attack bonus, you would expect to do zero damage with each shot. The algorithm is kind though, and sets the minimum damage to 1. So, if you are battling against a monster with 200 more DR than you have DB, even with maxed weapon speed you will only be doing 3 damage per second.

How is the monster DR calculated? A monster splits all the points it has between DB and DR. So, the DR is is the Monster's level * 3.5. So, a level 100 monster will have DR of 350. Monster level is the (minimum player level*0.25) + 2*wave no.
So, if you are on wave 12, and the minimum player alive is level 50, the monsters are level (50*0.25)+(12*2)=36, giving them a DR of 126.

So, if your basic damage done with the shock per hit would be 45.
With weapon speed 0 and DB 0, you do 45*(1+(0-126)/200) = 16.7 damage per shot, or 33.4 damage/sec.
with weapon speed 50 and DB 0, you still do 16.7 damage per shot, which gives 50 damage/sec
with weapon speed 0 and DB 50, you do 45*(1+(50-126)/200) = 27.9 damage per shot, or 55.8 damage per sec.

What about the lower levels?
If the lowest player is level 12, and you are on wave 3, monster level is 10, giving a DR of 35.
With weapon speed 0 and DB 0, you do 45*(1+(0-35)/200) = 37.1 damage per shot, or 74.2 damage/sec.
with weapon speed 50 and DB 0, you still do 37.1 damage per shot, which gives 113 damage/sec
with weapon speed 0 and DB 50, you do 45*(1+(50-35)/200) = 48.4 damage per shot, or 96.8 damage per sec.

So, which is best depends on if you have an infinite weapon or lots of resupply, and what level the monsters are you are attacking.

I have a more qualitative answer:

Regardless of your class, your weapon speed should be maxed at 50 early on - I would say before level 30 at the very latest.

More weapon speed allows you to get more shots off, gives you more flexibility, and allows you to hit more often. Since you're not the only one shooting monsters, the key here is that flexibility. Hit more, earn more xp!

Moof wrote:

Hit more, earn more xp!

Except xp isn't related to how often you hit something, it's related to how much damage you do.

The first shot isn't related to weapon speed. And if there are other people shooting the same monster, that one hit might be all you get. So you want it to count for as much as possible.

If you always have an infinite mini, certainly max your weapon speed. Or if you know you will usually have a piercing weapon. Otherwise, maxing your weapon speed without having resupply could mean you run out of ammo at just the wrong time.

Another thing to consider is what class you are. If you are a Weapons Master, you need to get 50 attack bonus in order to buy Vampire. So it isn't just a comparison as to which does the most damage - other factors influence the choice.

Ok. you are correct.

Damage = EXP. It then becomes, How accurate are you? Then apply the above formula to the weapon you are most likely to use and modify for your accuracy.

If you need to know how accurate you are, play on a server that keeps stats. When talking to people over this subject, most people (even very good players) become surprised at just how many shots they fire actualy miss.

Once you have all of this information, you can make an acurate decision on weapon speed or attack bonus.

I found that my play style (and the fact that I usualy play late at night when the server is nearly empty) favors weapon speed slightly.

There is no right or wrong on this one really. It all depends on the style of game you play and what your long term goals are.
I am just trying to provide the information so people can make that choice.

As far as accuracy goes, yes that is one more factor to take into account. However, if you miss with 50% of your shots it doesn't matter if you maxed weapon speed or attack bonus - your damage per sec will be less, but still in the same ratio to each other, since you miss the same % on both. However, I suspect that as weapon speed increases, the miss % will increase slightly as well.

There are other factors to take into account as well. Most monsters pause for a short while before firing. Does a slightly higher weapon speed mean you get the second shot in before the monster has time to fire? That could make a big difference.

Regardless of which one you choose to put points in first, they both should be bought as soon as possible. Those two skills will affect the amount of xp you gain the most. I takes less than 20 lvls to max both skills out. With the low amount of xp is needed to lvl and the new skills for low lvl players, it doesn't take long to get those 20 lvl's.

Wow! Talk 'bout an informative thread, especially w/ Szlat's contributions!

I especially appreciate the above-and-beyond information regarding the monster DR, how it's calculated, and the clear-cut examples provided to outline the various speed vs. attack scenarios.

Thanks! Now to figure out how to lure a "designated lvl5 bait" into the game.

reyalsnogard wrote:

Wow! Now to figure out how to lure "designated lvl5 bait" into the game.

You have been veeeerrrrry good bait, my friend.

I agree with the others-max out wep speed and wep damage asap. Then start on ammo/health/damage reduction. As to accuracy, I figure 10% to 15% of your shots, depending on the weapon, are good for damage points.

I'll throw in the required statement.

Figure out your play style and buy the class, skills, and attributes that best compliment your play style. Maybe weapon speed isn't as important to you as adrenaline. Maybe survival and health are better for you than lots of damage.

just my 2c