the triple converted to a double, and probably eat adrenaline slightly slower the piercing and vorpal nerfed slightly to balance them with other weapons all weapons (including piercing and vorpal) increased in power by 20% to 40% (either in damage or preferably their individual power-ups).  

Wouldnt a piercing wep thats increased by 20-40% plus a double do close to as much damage as a triple and the current piercing??? 

I agree that the piercing weps should have been reduced when the regular weapons were reduced(when they were reduced to +4 for +6)...and I often thought it was to help during the later waves.....

Szlat wrote:

the triple converted to a double, and probably eat adrenaline slightly slower the piercing and vorpal nerfed slightly to balance them with other weapons all weapons (including piercing and vorpal) increased in power by 20% to 40% (either in damage or preferably their individual power-ups).  

Sry Szlat I cant help it ^:)^ but.... Wouldnt a piercing wep thats increased by 20-40% plus a double do close to as much damage as a triple and the current piercing??? Or would this double in place of the triple(I really like this idea) still be taboo for piercing weapons. I dont think that the vorpal or rage should ever be doubled/tripled, then again I was not playing on this server when it was possible so I never experienced it. 

Micron(Micron) wrote:

Wouldnt a piercing wep thats increased by 20-40% plus a double do close to as much damage as a triple and the current piercing??? 

Piercing+6 currently does 1.3 times damage. Nerf it so only say +3% per plus so now 1.18 times Increase all weapons by +20 to +40%, gives say 1.4 times damage. Double 1.4 to 2.8 times damage. Currently 1.3 tripled gives 3.9 times damage I think if the +20% to +40% is on damage, it would need to be around +20%. If the increase was on the powerup (e.g. vampire, energy, null entropy), it could be higher - individual powerups would have to be assessed on a one-by-one basis. 

2 cents added here..... With rage vorpal and piercing no longer being tripled might I suggest loweing the drain time on the triple artifact. And possably changing the loaded artifacts to a double instead of the triple for artifact players who need and extra boost 

Sry deadoon I just dont understand how piercing prevents you from leveling? :-? Or do you mean when you do damage to youself with a piercing weapon? 

.....vorpal keeps exp low .... 

deadoon wrote:

.....vorpal keeps exp low .... 

There is a misconception that vorpal weapons give you low xp. Compare a vorpal+10 shock against a damage+4 shock. Assume a shock does 45 damage on its primary fire. The vorpal thus does 90 damage, the +4 does 63. If you fire 20 shots with each, the +4 does 20*63 = 1260 damage. The vorpal on average will instakill once. The other 19 shots give 19*90 = 1710 damage. So, since xp is directly related to damage, one third more xp to the vorpal (approx 34 compared to 25). Also bear in mind that the larger monsters tend to be scaled at 1xp per 50 health. So the +4 shot of max 63 damage that kills the monster would typically only get 2 xp compared to the 1 xp for the instakill. (Granted, it may be as high as 3xp if running berserk). An instakilled monster will have not released all the xp it could have, but provided there are other monsters to shoot at, no problem - another will spawn shortly. So, against titans, the vorpal will have given you 2 kills and 35 xp, the +4 only 1 kill and 25xp. And although the instakill only gives you 1 xp, it does still count towards multi-kill sprees, and they can generate significant xp. And you still get the adrenaline for the kill, which helps with a triple or berserk.  

Quick thought: I understand why we don't have multiple powers on a single weapon, why do the monsters get them then? Is it just a balance issue? 

Grizzled_Imposter wrote:

Quick thought: I understand why we don't have multiple powers on a single weapon, why do the monsters get them then? Is it just a balance issue? 

They don't, as far as I am aware? The Poison Queen gets null entropy on its web shot, and poison on its claw and stab, but they count as different weapons. 

Ultimately, I think several of you are missing what I view as the central point of this server: to have fun. Yes, not allowing piercing and triple will decrease LA scores (although I doubt if even that will be significant). Yes, the LAs higher up on the chart have already benefitted from that. The question to ask yourselves is this, does this change make the game significantly less fun to play?  

I don't know what they are called but the little guys with the batons that they spin. The blue one's shots are both penetrating and freezing.  

The question to ask yourselves is this, does this change make the game significantly less fun to play? 

Shantara wrote:

The question to ask yourselves is this, does this change make the game significantly less fun to play? 

Good point. More fun, as the higher levels were getting a bit stuck on piercing weapons. 

Yes cus we are sooo horrible.. 8-| besides havtn you heard we are being nerfed :P 

Grizzled_Imposter wrote:

I don't know what they are called but the little guys with the batons that they spin. The blue one's shots are both penetrating and freezing.  

As far as I am aware, they are freezing but not penetrating. They stop at the first person they hit. It is possible that they may appear to go through one person and hit another, but that will probably just be slight timing differences between the server and the client - only one person will get the damage and the freeze. 

I'd like to repeat my question: Does a person using a piercing weapon receive the benefits of Damage Bonus? 

Szlat wrote:

Grizzled_Imposter wrote:

I don't know what they are called but the little guys with the batons that they spin. The blue one's shots are both penetrating and freezing.  

As far as I am aware, they are freezing but not penetrating. They stop at the first person they hit. It is possible that they may appear to go through one person and hit another, but that will probably just be slight timing differences between the server and the client - only one person will get the damage and the freeze. 

Well if it goes through my sent, and destroys it, and then goes through me and freezes me, I'm pretty sure its not a timing issue. For awhile I thought that it might be the case, but recently I have seen cases where both parties appeared to freeze and were killed due to "inactivity" essentially being unable to get away. 

Grizzled_Imposter wrote:

Szlat wrote:

Grizzled_Imposter wrote:

I don't know what they are called but the little guys with the batons that they spin. The blue one's shots are both penetrating and freezing.  

As far as I am aware, they are freezing but not penetrating. They stop at the first person they hit. It is possible that they may appear to go through one person and hit another, but that will probably just be slight timing differences between the server and the client - only one person will get the damage and the freeze. 

Well if it goes through my sent, and destroys it, and then goes through me and freezes me, I'm pretty sure its not a timing issue. For awhile I thought that it might be the case, but recently I have seen cases where both parties appeared to freeze and were killed due to "inactivity" essentially being unable to get away. 

I am pretty sure they are not penetrating. They are projectiles, and penetrating is normally only allowed on instant fire weapons. I wonder if they do splash damage? 

Szlat wrote:

Grizzled_Imposter wrote:

Szlat wrote:

Grizzled_Imposter wrote:

I don't know what they are called but the little guys with the batons that they spin. The blue one's shots are both penetrating and freezing.  

As far as I am aware, they are freezing but not penetrating. They stop at the first person they hit. It is possible that they may appear to go through one person and hit another, but that will probably just be slight timing differences between the server and the client - only one person will get the damage and the freeze. 

Well if it goes through my sent, and destroys it, and then goes through me and freezes me, I'm pretty sure its not a timing issue. For awhile I thought that it might be the case, but recently I have seen cases where both parties appeared to freeze and were killed due to "inactivity" essentially being unable to get away. 

I am pretty sure they are not penetrating. They are projectiles, and penetrating is normally only allowed on instant fire weapons. I wonder if they do splash damage? 

Do the rules that we use on weapon types apply to the monsters? It would be easy enough to check on a test server.  

Essentially I suicided for the first 11 or so waves in an attempt to get a piercing weapon and then attempted to survive for the remaining waves. It was either do that in an attempt to win the map for the rest of the players or just play to get on the high score table.  

But let me ask this: wouldn't the game become stale if you won every game you played? 

Some players are just tooooooo serious. For heaven's sake, it's just a game to be played and enjoyed with friends. 

Mach wrote:

Essentially I suicided for the first 11 or so waves in an attempt to get a piercing weapon and then attempted to survive for the remaining waves. It was either do that in an attempt to win the map for the rest of the players or just play to get on the high score table.  

Maybe I'm in the minority here, but I play to have fun with other players. Winning the map or obtaining a new high score is simply a bonus to me. If we die... oh well, start a new map and everyone keeps on playing. To me, the compatibility of the triple with piercing weapons has no relation with the entertainment value of the game. But let me ask this: wouldn't the game become stale if you won every game you played? 

(DC)DEMONSLAYER wrote:

Some players are just tooooooo serious. For heaven's sake, it's just a game to be played and enjoyed with friends. 

Thank you Demon! I'm glad I don't stand alone on the fun side. 

Maybe I'm in the minority here, but I play to have fun with other players. Winning the map or obtaining a new high score is simply a bonus to me. If we die... oh well, start a new map and everyone keeps on playing. To me, the compatibility of the triple with piercing weapons has no relation with the entertainment value of the game. But let me ask this: wouldn't the game become stale if you won every game you played? 

Although I agree with you Echo I think the flaw in many of us high levelers is the thrill of competition, which essentially makes us strive to do better than the other players. I know this is true of many of us on the server otherwise why would you spend so much time updating the high score table/records(I believe it was you who took it over because it wasnt being kept up) So I know you enjoy the competition as I do. Although I must admit that being 1000-1500 points ahead of the next closest player is becoming quite stale :-? Perhaps I should try starting a new class except for one problem...........I like to win!! lol :))  

I've been playing Unreal Tournament for 7yrs. Yeah.....it is fun! :thumbup: By the way....Demonslayer.....I noticed you are catching up to me on levels :wink: 

{AW}Violator wrote:

I've been playing Unreal Tournament for 7yrs. Yeah.....it is fun! :thumbup: By the way....Demonslayer.....I noticed you are catching up to me on levels :wink: 

So have I. Started with the original Unreal/Return to Nali Pali/UT/Unreal 2/UT03/UT04 and loved every minute of it. Hmmm, wonder if there is a way to import some of the enemies from Unreal 2 into UT04? It might make it "less" stale for some players. And Violator, remember that I am alternating between Demonslayer and Demonmedic right now!!!!!!!!! 

(DC)DEMONSLAYER wrote:

{AW}Violator wrote:

I've been playing Unreal Tournament for 7yrs. Yeah.....it is fun! :thumbup: By the way....Demonslayer.....I noticed you are catching up to me on levels :wink: 

So have I. Started with the original Unreal/Return to Nali Pali/UT/Unreal 2/UT03/UT04 and loved every minute of it. Hmmm, wonder if there is a way to import some of the enemies from Unreal 2 into UT04? It might make it "less" stale for some players. And Violator, remember that I am alternating between Demonslayer and Demonmedic right now!!!!!!!!! 

Have you ever been in an Unreal Tournament Clan? If so, under what Tag and Name. Do you remember any of these clans----VSK, FSW, LAD. I was in those clans through UT'99 and UT2k3. Also, I occasionally play an Adren Master---{AW}Violator.A.M, but not too often.